Author Topic: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands  (Read 37298 times)

dak

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Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2012, 11:26:02 AM »
Quote from: Beth C

Do you use the food color with your Ameraucanas? I tried last year, but it didn\'t show up. Do you use regular food color or the paste type they use for icing? That would make my life easier. I don\'t have enough breeding cages to keep everyone separate, so I have a group of hens in a run with one cock, and rotate them in & out of cages to collect & mark eggs. Which means I can only ID half my eggs on any given day.


I use the liquid food color.  I have to apply it 2 -3 days in a row and then only get a few realiable days of streaks on the eggs though there will usually be a hen or so that it will last much longer.  It is only a short term thing so I can identify who is laying what.  I had a green egg layer in my Black pen last year and was able to isolate her pretty quick.

greeneggsandham

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Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2012, 11:33:55 AM »
Quote from: dak
Quote from: Beth C

Do you use the food color with your Ameraucanas? I tried last year, but it didn\'t show up. Do you use regular food color or the paste type they use for icing? That would make my life easier. I don\'t have enough breeding cages to keep everyone separate, so I have a group of hens in a run with one cock, and rotate them in & out of cages to collect & mark eggs. Which means I can only ID half my eggs on any given day.


I use the liquid food color.  I have to apply it 2 -3 days in a row and then only get a few realiable days of streaks on the eggs though there will usually be a hen or so that it will last much longer.  It is only a short term thing so I can identify who is laying what.  I had a green egg layer in my Black pen last year and was able to isolate her pretty quick.


Well that\'s an interesting method.  Could you tell us how its done?  How much food color do you use and do you just use a syringe to insert it?  Does it affect the chick or hatchability at all?
Sharon
Hubby rues the day he brought the chicks home...

dak

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Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2012, 09:44:23 PM »
Quote from: greeneggs&ham
Quote from: dak
Quote from: Beth C

Do you use the food color with your Ameraucanas? I tried last year, but it didn\'t show up. Do you use regular food color or the paste type they use for icing? That would make my life easier. I don\'t have enough breeding cages to keep everyone separate, so I have a group of hens in a run with one cock, and rotate them in & out of cages to collect & mark eggs. Which means I can only ID half my eggs on any given day.


I use the liquid food color.  I have to apply it 2 -3 days in a row and then only get a few realiable days of streaks on the eggs though there will usually be a hen or so that it will last much longer.  It is only a short term thing so I can identify who is laying what.  I had a green egg layer in my Black pen last year and was able to isolate her pretty quick.


Well that\'s an interesting method.  Could you tell us how its done?  How much food color do you use and do you just use a syringe to insert it?  Does it affect the chick or hatchability at all?


I turn the girl upside down and drop 7-8 drops on their vent,  similar to what you do when you AI a female.  Most of it gets pooped out.  There are only faint streaks on the egg.  I have not see any issue with fertility/viability.  It will stain feathers around the vent and below on a light colored bird.


Rachel Carlberg

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2014, 05:35:02 AM »
(I'm hoping that this is going to bump this topic back to the top)

I'm planning to hatch quite a bit this spring, hopefully obtaining eggs from a few breeders as well as hatching from what I have now.
I really want to start right in being able to keep the birds organized, as I don't have multiple pens to keep them separated as they grow.

Sharon Yorks, I really like your idea of the rubber bands, but are they difficult to put on?
Is there a tool to apply them?
I tried the suggestion from another forum of using tiny elastic hair ties, but the chicks seemed to easily be able to remove them, and I was terrified they would eat the bands.

I\'m not sure if anyone else uses these, but here is a link to an ad on Ebay that is for little colored rubber bands. I use size 4 for when they first hatch, then I switch to size 5 when they are 10-14 days old. I really like them. It\'s just a temporary method for when they are real young. I am planning to get bigger sizes to see how well it works as they get bigger. Just another idea to ponder that is softer and more flexible than zip ties. All 6 colors come in one bag. They sell 100 bands for $7 no shipping. And you can reuse them. They stretch easy when trying to put them on and take them off.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/100-LEG-BANDS-CHICK-POULTRY-BIRD-QUAIL-EGG-SMALL-SIZE-5-/320365726791?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4a97490c47

Additionally, I am looking for a recommended option for banding the older birds.
I found these reusable, numbered bands on Twin City Poultry Supply and thought they might be a good option.https://www.twincitypoultrysupplies.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=8_69&zenid=5666fd99ec3980e5ece8ef3e04897d8b

I would greatly appreciate any suggestions!

Beth C

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2014, 11:04:37 AM »
Everyone's set up is a little different, so what works here may not be the best for you, but here is a run-down of my experience since I started this thread several years ago:

I have tried just about everything at this point (even resorted to tattooing one year, but couldn't read them after a few months), and my best luck by far has been with zip end wing bands (item 890 from National Band )

I have had very little luck with plastic bands. I had more break than I had stay on and the ones that didn't break the numbers rubbed off of.

The adjustable aluminum bands the NPIP guys use start coming off in a matter of days.

The aluminum butt end bands are pretty good on adults, although I've had a couple come off after several  years, but you need multiple applicators to apply different size bands.

I haven't tried the steel butt end bands.

I have found that rubber bands come off more often than not.

Zip ties stay on better but even if you can write a number on them it will rub off and it is imperative that they be removed and replaced on a regular basis because they will not break or stretch as the bird grows and will grow right into their leg.

With any leg band you have to continuously change them as the chick grows and try to match up the numbers or keep track in your records where #27 change to #53 etc. (and chances are you're going to drop and lose at least one #27 band before the bird is grown), so I don't like them for chicks, although they are easier to read than wing bands on adult birds.

I've given up on using leg bands for growing birds. You can put the wing band on as soon as the chick comes out of the incubator and, applied correctly, it will stay on for years. (I had a few come off the first year because I didn't get them sealed right). They rarely come off. I've only used the zip bands, so I don't know how they compare to the jiffy or tab end bands.

A final thought, if you are pedigreeing your birds and tracking is essential, what ever type of band you decide to go with you may want to buy 2 sets of each number and put one band on each leg/wing  because nothing is fail proof, and it is beyond frustrating when you have a great bird (or worse, a really terrible one) and can't identify where it came from because the band came off.

Edited to add: I think Patty was referring to wing badges instead of bands, but I'm not sure. Sure do wish she was here to ask...  :'(
« Last Edit: October 11, 2014, 11:11:55 AM by Beth C »

Sharon Yorks

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2014, 11:55:57 AM »
I'm planning to hatch quite a bit this spring, hopefully obtaining eggs from a few breeders as well as hatching from what I have now.

Sharon Yorks, I really like your idea of the rubber bands, but are they difficult to put on?
Is there a tool to apply them?
I tried the suggestion from another forum of using tiny elastic hair ties, but the chicks seemed to easily be able to remove them, and I was terrified they would eat the bands.

Rachel... Congratulations once again for winning the new member incubator drawing! Sounds like you will be putting it to good use. Did you get in touch with Victor and make arrangements to have it shipped to you?

The little rubber bands are very easy to put on and take off and they are reusable. No tool needed, just stretch them with your fingers like you would any rubber band. Over the past few years I have only had about 5 chicks (out of 100s) ever get them off, and all but 1 was during the first 2 days when the chicks legs are the smallest. The other chick that lost a band was a few weeks old and I have no idea how or why it came off. I'm assuming the chick caught it on something and it stretched. You do have to watch them closely (with all bands) as the chicks grow fast and they will need to be changed. That's why I mark down dates and somewhere between 10-14 days I change them all to the next size. I have also found that it helps in determining who the males and females are because "most times" the males legs fill out the bands more and are tighter.

With all methods of keeping them identified, it's all trial and error. This is what I like to use, but I'm sure other methods work very well.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2014, 11:59:08 AM by Sharon Yorks »
Sharon Yorks
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Rachel Carlberg

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2014, 02:23:31 PM »
Thank you both so much for your quick response!

It may be overkill, but I may try a combination of both until I figure out what works for me.

Sharon, it was so nice speaking with you the other day. I've already received the incubator, and Victor was able to suggest an automatic turner that will fit it perfectly  ;D

Now it's a matter of getting up the guts to contact some of the nearby breeders in the directory and get ready for spring!


Sharon Yorks

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2014, 07:16:47 PM »
I think trying more than one method is a great idea. Let us know how it works out. Victor has always been a wonderful person to work with. I'm glad you have the incubator in hand. I have one of those, too and think they are nice little machines. Order you some eggs and get crackin...I mean busy :-)
Sharon Yorks
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Susan Mouw

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #23 on: October 12, 2014, 09:23:38 AM »
Everyone's set up is a little different, so what works here may not be the best for you, but here is a run-down of my experience since I started this thread several years ago:

I have tried just about everything at this point (even resorted to tattooing one year, but couldn't read them after a few months), and my best luck by far has been with zip end wing bands (item 890 from National Band )

I have had very little luck with plastic bands. I had more break than I had stay on and the ones that didn't break the numbers rubbed off of.

The adjustable aluminum bands the NPIP guys use start coming off in a matter of days.

The aluminum butt end bands are pretty good on adults, although I've had a couple come off after several  years, but you need multiple applicators to apply different size bands.

I haven't tried the steel butt end bands.

I have found that rubber bands come off more often than not.

Zip ties stay on better but even if you can write a number on them it will rub off and it is imperative that they be removed and replaced on a regular basis because they will not break or stretch as the bird grows and will grow right into their leg.

With any leg band you have to continuously change them as the chick grows and try to match up the numbers or keep track in your records where #27 change to #53 etc. (and chances are you're going to drop and lose at least one #27 band before the bird is grown), so I don't like them for chicks, although they are easier to read than wing bands on adult birds.

I've given up on using leg bands for growing birds. You can put the wing band on as soon as the chick comes out of the incubator and, applied correctly, it will stay on for years. (I had a few come off the first year because I didn't get them sealed right). They rarely come off. I've only used the zip bands, so I don't know how they compare to the jiffy or tab end bands.

A final thought, if you are pedigreeing your birds and tracking is essential, what ever type of band you decide to go with you may want to buy 2 sets of each number and put one band on each leg/wing  because nothing is fail proof, and it is beyond frustrating when you have a great bird (or worse, a really terrible one) and can't identify where it came from because the band came off.

Edited to add: I think Patty was referring to wing badges instead of bands, but I'm not sure. Sure do wish she was here to ask...  :'(

Beth, what sizes are you using of the zip bands? I have all LF Ameraucanas and would like to try the wing banding for next spring's hatches.  How easy are they to put on?
Susan Mouw
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http://www.sandcastlesfarm.com

Beth C

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #24 on: October 12, 2014, 12:44:17 PM »
Susan: They are size 3. I've been using them on my LF and bantams with no problems. The 4 might be easier to read, but these are working so well I'm afraid to change anything - don't know if bigger ones would be more apt to snag. Besides, I bought 1000 so it will be a while before I order any more. When I do, though, I've noticed that they have colored eyelets available now and I think I'll buy those next time. You have to make sure the eyelet is through the hole before you clamp it, if it isn't lined up right it won't seal, and I think the colored eyelets would make it a lot easier to see. Other than that they're pretty easy to apply, you just have to buy the tool, and there is a video on the National Band site that walks you through. The chicks aren't impressed, but they don't seem to mind it any more than they do toe punching (or wrestling leg bands on and off). One thing, if you buy directly from National Band order early because it took me a long time to get mine (a couple of months if I remember).

greeneggsandham

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2014, 11:36:35 AM »
I'm planning to hatch quite a bit this spring, hopefully obtaining eggs from a few breeders as well as hatching from what I have now.

Sharon Yorks, I really like your idea of the rubber bands, but are they difficult to put on?
Is there a tool to apply them?
I tried the suggestion from another forum of using tiny elastic hair ties, but the chicks seemed to easily be able to remove them, and I was terrified they would eat the bands.


Rachel... Congratulations once again for winning the new member incubator drawing! Sounds like you will be putting it to good use. Did you get in touch with Victor and make arrangements to have it shipped to you?

The little rubber bands are very easy to put on and take off and they are reusable. No tool needed, just stretch them with your fingers like you would any rubber band. Over the past few years I have only had about 5 chicks (out of 100s) ever get them off, and all but 1 was during the first 2 days when the chicks legs are the smallest. The other chick that lost a band was a few weeks old and I have no idea how or why it came off. I'm assuming the chick caught it on something and it stretched. You do have to watch them closely (with all bands) as the chicks grow fast and they will need to be changed. That's why I mark down dates and somewhere between 10-14 days I change them all to the next size. I have also found that it helps in determining who the males and females are because "most times" the males legs fill out the bands more and are tighter.

With all methods of keeping them identified, it's all trial and error. This is what I like to use, but I'm sure other methods work very well.


Sharon where do you get those small rubber bands?  The link above is no longer viable.  I'd like to try those.

FYI, for anyone else, I have been using these on chicks.  Colors are limited, so it would work alright for limited numbers of pens, etc.
https://www.twincitypoultrysupplies.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=8_57&products_id=861&zenid=91c52b270a9a067751542b3b7dbf0a61

 I usually put these on at day three or four and they will work for a couple of weeks.  For the first few days, I use fingernail polish.  I paint their toes, shanks, etc., to identify them.  You do have to check them every third day because the polish does wear off.  After the chick coiled bands, I switch to another larger colored coiled band, then eventually switch to zip ties, which do have to be changed several times for growth.
Sharon
Hubby rues the day he brought the chicks home...

Birdcrazy

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2014, 01:00:59 PM »





Sharon where do you get those small rubber bands?  The link above is no longer viable.  I'd like to try those.


[/quote]                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             
I have been buying these from ebay for several years. The gal that I buy from is in Utah. She ships free. They are sizes 2,3,4,5, and 6. They come in 6 colors. Cost is $7 for 100. Her ebay handle is paintworx. You can do a search for chick rubber bands to find them. Look down the list, I think size 4 is the first you will see. Click on that item. At that screen click to the top right on see other items and it will show all of the sizes besides other items she sells. I hope this helps.
Gordon Gilliam

Art Smith

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #27 on: October 15, 2014, 07:42:48 PM »
Has anyone tried the tool used for castration to stretch the rubber leg bands to get them on the chicks? It does a good job stretching a small rubber band over a calf's testicles.

DeWayne Edgin

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #28 on: October 15, 2014, 08:55:48 PM »
Art we used it on tom cats to. It works good on them to.   ::)

Birdcrazy

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Re: Leg Bands vs. Wing Bands
« Reply #29 on: October 15, 2014, 10:53:09 PM »
The chick rubber are easily stretched by hand to put on their legs. Before I got my first order I looked around and found a small pair of reverse needle nose pliers with bent tips. I found out that it was just easier and faster to stretch them and put them on by hand. I didn't shoot too many across the room!
Gordon Gilliam