Author Topic: Frontline for mites and/or lice  (Read 48045 times)

Sharon Yorks

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Frontline for mites and/or lice
« on: January 31, 2013, 07:33:57 PM »
I know there has been a previous discussion on Frontline a while back, but I'd like to hear the latest on how well (or not) Frontline is working for everyone. Is it still recommended? Is there any affect on the hen's egg production or a drop in hatches? Do you have to wait to eat eggs...and any other questions that may be asked regarding the product. Whose all using it and how is it working out for you?
Sharon Yorks
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Max

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2013, 12:00:05 AM »
I've been using it since Paul recommended it last September. The results were incredible!! I had a Blue Cochin Bantam that was ate up with thousands of mites. I sprayed a spot the size of my thumb nail above the vent and they began to die immediately. 24 hours later I couldn't find anything alive on him. I sprayed the entire flock and they have been mite free ever since. There were no after effects. None of the birds got sick and egg production was steady. There is no wait period because it doesn't enter the blood stream(so i've read). If it continues to be this effective then it is all i will use. Tip:  It is a lot easier to apply at night when the birds are calm. I use a head light on my forehead so I have both hands free.  ;)
Max Strawn

Sharon Yorks

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2013, 09:02:50 AM »
Thanks, Max. Is it the same bottle you use on dogs or is it a different bottle. (Does the bottle have a picture of a dog or cat on it?) How long does it last on them and/or how often do you use it? And does it kill the eggs, too? I was told when using Sevin dust, you are suppose to dust them 3 times, 10 days apart so you can kill the entire cycle of eggs and all.
Sharon Yorks
Mark 11:23

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Sharon Yorks

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2013, 09:23:15 AM »
I found this on the Twin City Poultry web site. Is there a waiting period before you can eat or hatch the eggs.

http://www.twincitypoultrysupplies.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=435

H-2-8 Frontline Spray 8.5 oz. IT"S BACK !
$34.95

Back in stock and ready to ship! Large Bottle 250 ml / 8.5 oz.

This is the one that everyone has been asking about for lice and mites.  Frontline kills fleas up to three months and ticks for one month. Recomended once a month if pet has fleas which may cause flea allergy dermatitis. Remains effective even after bathing, water immersion, or exposure to sunlight. Not recommended for poultry for the production of eggs or meat!
Sharon Yorks
Mark 11:23

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John

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2013, 09:25:11 AM »
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Is it the same bottle you use on dogs or is it a different bottle.
You can order it from Peter Brown at First State Vet Supply and follow his directions for application.

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a previous discussion on Frontline a while back
http://ameraucana.org/forum/index.php?topic=199.0

Sharon Yorks

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2013, 09:42:49 AM »
Quote
Is it the same bottle you use on dogs or is it a different bottle.
You can order it from Peter Brown at First State Vet Supply and follow his directions for application.

Quote
a previous discussion on Frontline a while back
http://ameraucana.org/forum/index.php?topic=199.0

Thanks, John. I had seen this yesterday, but noticed is was a discussion from 2006. I was wanting a newer update on how it was working for everyone...and was also wanting to know more about it "before" I had to purchase it to get the directions for application.
Sharon Yorks
Mark 11:23

(Don't tell God how big your problem is, tell your problem how big your God is!)

Max

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2013, 10:15:11 AM »
Yep, thats the stuff. The cheapest i've found it is at Jeffers pet.  $29.89

http://www.jefferspet.com/frontline-spray/camid/PET/cp/0028814/
Max Strawn

Mike Gilbert

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2013, 10:36:46 AM »
Ivomec is cheaper and works very well.

John

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2013, 10:37:24 AM »
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I was wanting a newer update
I know, but wanted to make the old discussion available for others to see what had been said.
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I sprayed a spot the size of my thumb nail above the vent

I believe Peter suggests using an eye dropper. 
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There is no wait period because it doesn't enter the blood stream(so i've read).

Max, Frontline is for dogs and I don't know of anyone other than Peter that gives instructions for using it on birds.  I've read the info that comes from Frontline about the product and think we just have to be careful about recommending it or even making claims about it.  When it come to eating the eggs of hens that have been treated I go by my 21 day rule and wait that long before eating the of eggs of treated hens.

Chicks hatch after 21 days, With some vaccines you shouldn't collect eggs to eat for 21 days, When you bring news birds onto your property it is best to quarantine them for 21 days, a hen serviced by a cock could produce fertile eggs for up to 21 days...
« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 10:38:57 AM by John »

Max

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2013, 11:26:22 AM »
Good points John. Better to err on the side of safety.
Max Strawn

greeneggsandham

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2013, 09:22:49 PM »
I don't know if I've been lucky or just blind, but I have not had a problem with either lice or mites.  I have looked for them on roosts at night like recommended and see nothing.
 I use DE in my hen houses.  The food grade DE.  I use the atomizer to disperse it in every crack and crevice, on the walls and on the roosts.  I usually only apply it three or four times a year.  The inside of the houses stay fairly dry, so it doesn't need to be reapplied often.  My hens like to dustbath alot also.  If you manage to rid the birds of them, I suggest using the DE in the house to keep them out.
Sharon
Hubby rues the day he brought the chicks home...

Tailfeathers

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2013, 11:51:22 PM »
Very timely post. 

A couple of years ago I came home from a show and tossed a Trio of Buckeyes into a breeding pen by themselves.  About two weeks later the rooster started taking on this wet look and then started acting very larthegic.  I remember going out on a Thursday evening and saying, "Hang in their boy and I'll take you in Saturday, give you a nice bath, and see if I can figure out what's wrong with you."  Unfortunately, I found him dead Friday night.

Then about a week later I noticed one of the hens looking the same.  These birds were the offspring of the Ohio National Champion for some year (I'd have to go back and look at my records now cuz I don't remember) and the rooster that died was from the Dad or Brother or something of the Champion so I did NOT want to lose another one. 

So I take the bird inside the house to look it over good and give it a bath and all of a sudden I feel like I've got something crawling in my eyebrows, and on my ears, and such.  I look down and my hands are literally covered in hundreds - maybe thousands - of little mites.  Then hen was absolutely completely infested with them. 

Prior to that show I had never had any lice or mites on my place.  I've been trying to get rid of them ever since.  I've tried various Permethrin & Pyrethrin sprays.  That would seemingly knock the mites back a bit but never eliminate them.  I did learn that you can NOT wait 10 days between treatments like a lot of folks say and I recently read something online that says the mites will develop a resistance to the Permethrin/Pyrethrin.  My experience would concur with that conclusion.

I also tried Ivermectin Eprinex.  Again, knocked them back but did not eliminate them.  During my latest research at the same time I found the above info on Permethrin/Pyrethrins, I saw something that said they don't recommend Ivermectin because it takes an almost lethal dose to the chicken to do any good.

So I came across some sites that talked about other pesticides.  I don't recall all the names (I've got it written down somewhere) but I got some of them.  The main ingredient was the one you find in the "Spider Killer" bottles.  They worked better I think than the Permethrins but again, did not eliminate them.

So, I decided to try the Frontline.  I got the cheaper "Pronyl Max" at Wal-Mart.  It's about half the price of Frontline at the Co-Op and has the exact same ingredients.  Since I was being money conscious, I also got the one for the biggest dogs.  Like over 100 pounds.  I put 3-4 drops on each adult bird and it's been a week now and there is no sign of any mites at all.  Everything is dead.  That is a result that I never experienced with any of the other stuff.

Now, one last thing, I too was concerned about egg production and whether egg withdrawal is needed.  In my Google search "Frontline and Chickens", I came across one article by a scientist who laid out in detail why he believed there was no need to withdraw the eggs because the %% of Filopril (I think that's the active ingredient" would be so small that the harmful dosage to a human didn't even come close to being dangerous.

Some may recall that I called the national Poison Control Center a year or two ago and asked about Piperazine-17 and ingesting eggs and found the same thing.  So I've been eating the eggs and have had NO problems since.  Disclaimer:  That is a personal observation ONLY and can NOT be used in any way, shape, or form, as a legitimate authorization for eating eggs from any chicken treated with Frontline, Piperazine-17, or anything else.  Do so at your own risk!!!!!!

So, I'm gonna keep a close eye on the birds and am hoping that I have FINALLY gotten rid of the mites! 

God Bless,

Mike Gilbert

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2013, 08:56:24 AM »
Keep us up to date on that Royce.  It's good to know.   But the information they gave you about ivermectin was baloney.  I don't use the eprinex  - is that the variation where there is no withdrawal period?  If so it stands to reason it wouldn't be as effective.

John

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2013, 09:51:14 AM »
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I put 3-4 drops on each adult bird and it's been a week now and there is no sign of any mites at all.
Same thing here.  I use an eyedropper, putting one drop on the back of the neck, one on near the saddle area and one below the vent.  It is a two person job.  We make sure the Frontline goes on the skin and sometimes give an extra drop to LF.

Beth C

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Re: Frontline for mites and/or lice
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2013, 11:01:58 AM »
Interesting discussion, particularly Royce's info on withdrawal periods.

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Not recommended for poultry for the production of eggs or meat!

Manufacturers need to cover themselves when their products are used off-label. It doesn't  mean it's necessarily unsafe, just that it hasn't been tested & approved and they assume no responsibility for off-label use - you're on your own. We use a lot of off-label meds with goats, since there aren't very many that have been tested & approved (apparently we aren't a large enough share of the market to justify the expense).

For the same reason: not encouraging off-label use of insecticides and anyone who chooses to does so at their own risk.

I've personally been using a combination of Absorbine Ultra Shield EX and Frontline Spray. I alternate between the 2 in hopes of avoiding resistance. I've never used the vials of Frontline because I had heard there was an extra ingredient, but I just noticed that's the Frontline Plus, Fipronil appears to be the only active ingredient in the Top Spot, so may try that - certainly easier than spray and cheaper as well. The primary ingredient in the Ultra Shield is Permethrin, not sure why it works better than the Permethrin I've mix here to the same concentration, but I suspect it may be the addition of the synergist Piperonyl Butoxide. But whatever the reason, I've had better luck than with the straight Permethrin.

My "cooties" story was before my first show. I had several birds in one pen that looked awful, were losing weight, had ratty looking feathers, etc., and I was at a loss as to what to do. They were fed free choice and wormed and dusted regularly, so mites/lice weren't really on my radar. The morning I was leaving for the show I found several in bad shape & one died. The ones I was planning on showing, who were in a different pen, looked ok, but, fearing a horrible disease epidemic, I scratched everything and sent the dead one for a necropsy. I was mortified when they told me it died from a severe lice infestation - couldn't believe I didn't see it, but I really wasn't looking, since I *thought* I was treating/preventing (lesson learned - don't rely solely on dust), and in my inexperience I mistook the nits for dander (those birds hadn't finished moulting). It took about a month of weekly treatments to get them under control, then monthly for about a year. Now I treat quarterly.

Mike, I think I've ask you this before but I don't remember, how do you administer the Ivermectin? I keep the injectable on hand and give it to the goats & dogs orally. Do I put it in the chickens water like I do the Wazine, or spray them with Pour-On?