White large fowl hens

[Mike Gilbert]

True Ameraucanas that are white are the recessive kind of white.  When you have this, white to white will always produce white, although sometimes you get an occasional dark feather or two.   Your friend may have mixed in some dominant white from who knows where.   Two white birds that each carry only one copy of dominant white will throw about 25% dark birds.  Dominant white also does not cover up red feathers, so it is used in making the red pyle color.   When you don't know the genetic background of the birds you are working with you can often get unexpected results.

[DeWayne Edgin]

Thanks Mike. The guy i got these eggs from was the guy you told me about in an email. You may not remember it was earlier this year. I guess i should probably continue to look for a White to buy that was not in a Black cross. I am guessing this means the White birds that had the Black in them will always throw some Black along the way. Black is more dominate than White i think and will always come back from time to time.

[Mike Gilbert]

Was that the guy selling eggs on e-bay?  As I understand it, the guy selling eggs on e-bay for White Ameraucanas had the remainder of the late Anne Foley's birds.   I really don't know what she used to make them.   If it was some of Carl Fosbrink's they very well could have had some dominant white in them.   But let me repeat:  recessive white to recessive white will always throw white.   It makes no difference if black was crossed in at some time in the past or not.  All white birds have suppressed colors "underneath."   

[Jean]

DeWayne,

I'll see how many whites I have in either this hatch or the next one.  I should have some silvers hatching too.

The birds I received from Carl appear to be recessive white, they did carry the barring gene though.  I finally bred it out of my birds. 

I do get some chicks though that are yellow at hatch and have very light legs.  I have toe punched them and the legs darken within a week or so and they appear no different than the other birds in the clutch.

[Mike Gilbert]

I do get some chicks though that are yellow at hatch and have very light legs.  I have toe punched them and the legs darken within a week or so and they appear no different than the other birds in the clutch.

Those chicks might have one copy of barring, or a copy of wheaten.  Both will inhibit dermal melanin, but it eventually comes in.  I'm not sure if Dilute (Di) has an effect on demal melanin or not.

[Jean]

Mike,

I toe punched them to see what they would look like as adults to see if there were any problems with the leg color or leakage.

It could be id gene that dilutes the leg color???  (I think that is what the correct term is.)  I am pretty sure I got rid of the barring.  The buffs seem to carry the id, and wouldn't barred birds carry this also?

[John]

Those chicks might have one copy of barring, or a copy of wheaten.

Either way I wouldn't breed from them.
Since both buff and wheaten varieties are based on wheaten at the e-locus the shank color should develop the same in both...darken after a few weeks.

[Jean]

Those chicks might have one copy of barring, or a copy of wheaten.

Either way I wouldn't breed from them.
Since both buff and wheaten varieties are based on wheaten at the e-locus the shank color should develop the same in both...darken after a few weeks.

John,

I do not think it is either.  I bred all my whites to a blue cockerel last year and got no barred birds.  All offspring were blue, black or splash.

[Jean]

If it is two copies of id, I will have to see if the toe punch birds are all males.....

[Mike Gilbert]

Jean, id is what you want.  You don't want Id.  Id is dominant over id, so if it were there the birds would not have slate legs at all.  So I don't think that is the problem.   I noticed the same issue in bantam whites many years ago, and it is still there today in some of the buffs.  I would not be surprised if it were Di (dilute) or a similar dominant gene.

[Jean]

At least they are all toe punched and can be removed.....

[DeWayne Edgin]

Mike these were eggs from Anne Foleys birds. The guy was selling them on Ebay, which i did not until i called him. He claimed that every once in a while one would come out with a Black feather but these were all Black or mostly Black. I am not keeping them though because who knows what they might be mixed with.

[DeWayne Edgin]

Jean maybe we could even do a mixture of chicks. If you ship 15 in a box, i would take like 8 Silvers and 7 whites. Or if you ship 20 i would take 10 Whites and 10 Silvers. How ever many you ship for heat just give me half and half. If you can not make as many of one as the other then just send me more of the ones that you can. Eggs are a gamble and i think i am done gambling. Thanks.

[Mike Gilbert]

Mike these were eggs from Anne Foleys birds. The guy was selling them on Ebay, which i did not until i called him. He claimed that every once in a while one would come out with a Black feather but these were all Black or mostly Black. I am not keeping them though because who knows what they might be mixed with.

Anne had both whites and blacks, so I'm betting he either sent you some eggs from the blacks, or else a rooster got in the wrong pen for a while.  Either way, I would not be afraid to use the chicks that came out white.

[DeWayne Edgin]

I only got one that was mostly White and it had Black spots all over it. It kinda looks like a splash.