Top line and Tail Sets

[Susan Mouw]

Going through years of pictures from so many meets over the years has really been an education!  One of the things I've been struggling with is toplines and tail sets.  Having worked with horses (Arabians - level top line is crucial!) and show dogs (various, but most recently Labradors), I understand the concept of toplines and tail sets, but wasn't sure if I was visualizing it properly.

So, being the computer nerd that I am, I decided to put a few to the test - and hopefully, in the process, train my eye for correct topline and tail set in Ameraucanas.

First, I had to look up what the APA standard says about topline (back) and tail sets.  Since both the bantam and large fowl are identical (Note - there is an error for female large fowls in the APA 2010 Standard of Perfection that will be corrected in the next issue), I'm only copying and pasting one for males and one for females:

Males:

• Back: Medium length, broad, carried slightly elevated at the shoulders.
• Tail: Well spread, medium length, carried at 45 degree above horizontal, sickles well-curved.

Female

• Back: Medium length, relatively broad, slightly elevated at the shoulders.
• Tail: Medium length, well spread, top two feathers slightly curved, carried at 40 degree angle above horizontal.

Ok, so now I know what it is supposed to look like. But, I'm a visual person and need to see something to really get it soaked into my brain.  So I drew the following picture with three lines.  One is a flat horizontal line, one is a slightly elevated topline (The standard doesn't give an angle. I used 12.5 degrees and it seemed to work fairly well. Some may vary a little below or a little above this). The third line represents the tail set, or angle.  Remember this is 40 or 45 degrees from horizontal - not from the angle of the back (I had to keep reminding myself of this).

Males:


Females:


Well, that helped some, but I really needed to see it actually applied to some images of Ameraucana chickens - both bantam and large fowl.

The following pictures are all pictures that were taken from the various Meet Results. The image of the bird was cropped from the background, and solidly colored so as to remove identifying characteristics.

Bantam Males:

This first one was not a surprise. I could tell it just wasn't right, but until I applied the graphic, it was hard to tell what was wrong.



This one is much better!



Bantam Females:







Large Fowl Males:







Large Fowl Females



I welcome any comments, critiques, or other feed back!

[Don]

Nice Post Susan,  I does make it much easier to see how the profiles of various birds compare to the standard language.  I will note that IMO the head should be well above the tail.  There is one profile where the chicken appears to be leaning down for a moment.  But most look pretty much on target. 

The wing carriage is another thing that I always have trouble determining too.  So many years trying to get the Plymouth Rock bantams to lift their wings is ingrained.   Now I have to remember that AMs are allowed a bit lower wing carriage. 

[greeneggsandham]

Idk, I'm a bit confused when they say above horizontal, but if you are measuring the angle from your bottom horizontal line (their back) the angle looks high.  So, I dug out the old protractor and put it up against the computer screen.  The male is sitting at 55 degrees and the female at 50 degrees.  Close, but a little off.
But if it is measured from the horizon line or a straight horizontal line, it looks about right.

But that's a great way to check them.  Now, if I could only get shadow images of the birds.

[Susan Mouw]

The bottom line that goes straight across the screen is the horizontal line.  The other two lines are (for males) is 167.5 (12.5 flipped backwards) and 45 - from horizontal. The tail set line should not be measured from the back line - that will result in inaccurate readings.

Here is another picture, with a line at 90 degrees.  As you can clearly see, the 45 evenly dissects the space between horizontal (or 180) and 90..as it should.  A 55 degree angle would not split it evenly.

[Susan Mouw]

Maybe these will help you more, Sharon:

[greeneggsandham]

Yep.  I edited my post.  It depends on where you measure from which I never was sure of but assumed a straight line from the back.  I guess the only thing that is subject to slight changes is the shoulder slope.

[Birdcrazy]

Susan, now you've done it. It looks like I'll need to get the old geometry books out (not one of my favorite subjects in school long, long ago) and study up. Angles, protractors etc. Thank goodness you put the images of chickens with the lines and angles. That really helped me to visualize better. I do think that Don made a very valid point. The stance or position that the bird is taking may alter the actual top line or tail set of the bird if it is not standing naturally.

[Susan Mouw]

The stance or position that the bird is taking may alter the actual top line or tail set of the bird if it is not standing naturally.

Very true!  I tried to choose birds that looked like they were standing 'squarely' (an old horse term, but you know what I mean).  I could choose some more, but I thought this would at least give folks an idea.

It was such an eye-opener for me! Hopefully, it will help some others, too.

[Kitsch6]

Sharon, you can find a set of profiles on the APA site.  They are used by juniors for breed ID but very useful all the way around!

Christine Kitsch