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LF buff leg color

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John:

--- Quote ---...The birds are around three months old now.  Some of them are noticeably smaller than the others.  Is this a different line of birds?  Also, some of them have nice slate legs (looking like mostly females) and some have a slate look to them, they appear kind of slate with flesh color here and there.
I will be culling the birds with off color plumage and legs in a month or so; so should I go ahead and get rid of the birds with the poor leg color now?
Also, my buff birds I got last year have great color & plumage everyone around here that has seen them loves them.  My problem with my birds has been the poor fertility, egg color, size and the tail set being slightly off.  My lines are pretty docile, they have great leg color...Do you think I would have better luck improving the leg color by breeding your bigger pullets with my smaller roos?
--- End quote ---


I know you aren\'t knocking me or my birds so don\'t worry about what others may think.  Knowledgeable Ameraucana breeders know that really good LF buffs are rare and that you aren\'t buying show quality birds when you buy day old chicks.  Some may grow up to be show quality though and some will be culls.  With LF buffs we still have too many that end up as culls and need more folks like you breeding them up to where they should be.  
I used two main breeding pens for LF buffs this past season and used a couple really big males over my smallest females in one pen.  The other pen had females that were the same size or larger with males that weren\'t as large as the two used in the other pen.  I hope that makes sense.
Your cockerel, in the photo, has great leg color.  If he also has good buff under color and no white or black feathers I would use him over the largest good pullets from Paul and me.  Crossing the strains should also help fertility (besides alternating at least two cocks per breeding pen).  Maybe use the two largest cockerels from us, with some blue/slate showing in their legs, over the best pullets from your stain.   The following year cross the males from the one mating over the females of the other and the other way around, keeping two lines going.  Always breed from the best you have which doesn\'t mean they are perfect.  Compensation mating is important and I always keep it in mind as I choose which birds to breed together.  If the males are small, but have great leg color put them over the biggest females with blotchy slate leg color.  That is what I mean by compensation mating.  Someday when all those traits are looking good you will still find that the birds aren\'t perfect and you\'ll still want to use this same mating practice.  You can\'t make improvement to all the traits each breeding season.  Come up with priorities and goals for each breeding season.  Breed for buff color, buff under color, slate legs, pea comb, muffs/bread, eye color, type, size, tail angle, not too fluffy, egg color, etc.  Prioritize knowing it is an ongoing project that will take years.
The buffs are all very docile and that is a trait we need to keep also.    
Don\'t be in a hurry to cull just for leg color.  Read Mike\'s comments about that subject.  If you have a great bird but the legs aren\'t slate it may still produce many slate legged offspring bred to the right mate.  If its soles/pads are pinkish/white and you can see some blue/slate in the shanks/legs it could be a valuable breeder to you.

Mike Gilbert:

John, is that last pic one of yours?   Maybe it should replace the LF Buff male currently on the pictures link so as not to confuse some folks?   This one shows excellent shank color.

Jean:
Mike, that is one of my buff roos.  B) He is out of McKinney stock and I had to do a lot of cullling to find him. I am very proud of him!  He has a roost mate that is very similar except his tail is shorter.

He is what I plan to cross my pullets from John and Paul with.  I have decided that I am going to breed for size and plumage color first.  I have quite a few nice pullets out in the garden, so I think I can really work on those two items first.  

As I was staring at all my lovely birds, it occured to me that I may even have a couple  breeding trios that I could sell.  I also have some nice cockerels and pullets from my starter flock.

Jean  :D

Attached is the other roo...  You may use any of my pictures also for the web site.

Jean:
My photo is too large and I cannot make it small enough.  I guess we\'ll have to use our imagination.  Same color rooster, shorter tail .  HE HE

Jean

John:

--- Quote ---Maybe it should replace the LF Buff male currently on the pictures link
--- End quote ---

I replaced the one I had with him.
His shank color is great, but he appears to be on the small side as Jean said that is a problem with her buffs.  I would guess that he is at least 1/4 bantam.  The cross to bantam would bring down the size and improve leg color.  I used a bantam buff male several years ago on my LF buff females.  The problem with it is trying to get the size back after such a cross.
If someone wants to start from scratch to breed LF buffs I would suggest crossing LF buff Orpingtons with LF buff laced Polish then take the F1 birds and cross them with bantam buff Ameraucanas.  Breed the best of the F2 birds together and keep selecting for the best.
When I started LF buffs Mike and I were still developing the bantam buffs.

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