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Silver Standard Description

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Guest:
Greetings Ameraucana folks - I was going to post this to Mike G., but then I was up here on the board so maybe broader inquiries will yield more feedback.

In doing some Standard revision research on the blue egg cousins the Araucanas, it was discovered that there is an apparent contradiction for Silver Ameraucanas between the ABA and APA descriptions.

Under the APA description for Silver Ameraucanas, it makes reference back to the Silver Leghorn description.  For males this indicates a silver hackle with black striping, and a silver saddle (no striping).  

Under the ABA description for the Silver pattern that is indicated for Ameraucana Bantams, that pattern (which the ABA also uses for Leghorn Bantams) calls for males that are black striped in the silver hackle, and the same color for the saddle.

APA calls for clear saddle, the ABA for a striped saddle.  

I would be interested to know what the Silver Ameraucana males look like in hackle and saddle, and whether the ABC participants feel one or the other is the \"correct\" description.  My own recollection of Silver Ameraucanas is that they tend to show some striping in the saddle, but that doesn\'t necessarily mean that striped saddles should be the ideal Standard color.

Thoughts?  Feedback?  It is clear that there is a contradiction between the ABA and APA, and the first place to inquire is of the breeders.

Sam Brush

Mike Gilbert:
Sam,

Are you also attempting to resolve the difference for the Leghorn breed?    My gut feeling is to go along with whatever is decided for leghorns, as it is supposed to be the same color pattern.    I believe they could be bred either way, it should be just a matter of selection over time.    Our main problem in the Ameraucanas is ridding the females of shafting, and if that problem is related to saddle color in the males (I don\'t know that it is or is not) then I would hate to commit to a position that prevented cleaning up the female\'s shafting problem.   No one I have spoken with seems to know much about eliminating shafting, including Dr. Okimoto who may be poultrydom\'s most respected color geneticist at the present time.   Your thoughts?   How about the rest of you members?

Mike Gilbert

Guest:

Well, I may comment..but I am not the best , as I am still vary new to poultry.
I have found 2 disctnct types of \"Silver\'s\", one is trhe silver duckwing, which is supposed to have a clear saddle, and even a nearly clear hackle, as well as th barring on the wing.
The other is just \"Silver\", this one is darker, and has deffinate striping in both the hakle and saddle...So am I maybe confusing thre terms??  What is the actual differance between \"Silver\" and \"Silver Duckwing\"?
 :thinking:

Guest:
Mike, originally the Leghorns were assigned the \"Silver Duckwing\" pattern and name, but somewhere along the way that was revised to what is essentially a silver version of the Brown Leghorn - with clear saddle color.  As you may have noted, the Leghorn proponents have a proposal to do the same with the Golden Duckwing Leghorn.  In discussions with one of the more noted Brown Leghorn breeders, who also has Silvers, his view was that the clear saddles have some link to female breast color among other things.  I will ask about the shafting.  At the Syracuse APA Annual I inquired of another Leghorn specialist and judge, who confirmed that the Leghorn standard for Silver was the clear silver saddled male, but then he proceeded to produce actual live Silver Leghorn Bantam males that had some saddle striping.  Pretty confusing.  The Dutch Bantams, which are  similar overall to the Leghorns, call for the Silver variant with striping in both saddle and hackle.  

There are two forms of Silver (clear saddle & striped hackle plus striped saddle and hackle) and it seems that there may be a need to tighten up a bit on which form is aligned with specific breeds with that variety.  So far the Leghorn folks seem to suggest that the clear saddled form is the legitimate one for at least Leghorns.  I need to line out all the male and female descriptions in comparison to see if there are other significant variations that might assist in the evaluation.

Sam Brush

Guest:
In response to McKee Fowl Farm\'s question, in addition to the apparent two forms of \"Silver\" in my prior post, there is the Silver Duckwing, which is distinguished by the clear hackle and saddle.  All three are obviously related in some fashion, and perhaps are just slightly different expressions.  In the duckwings, however, the press is for clear hackle and saddle in males, with little or no striping being considered the desired look.

Sam Brush

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