Ameraucana Breeders Club
The Official Forum of the Ameraucana Breeders Club => Ameraucana Marketplace => Topic started by: Mike Gilbert on January 18, 2010, 09:02:09 AM
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Word has it out of Massachusetts, where the ABA held its 2009 national meet last weekend, that they have awarded their 2010 national to the show at Columbus, and the 2011 to the big show at Indianapolis. The latter passed by only one vote. So there will be another combined APA and ABA meet in Indianapolis in October 2011. Will the Ameraucana Breeders Club participate? I believe our national is scheduled for the South Central District in 2011. Paul, what do you think?
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Personally, we here feel that the rotation should be broken for 1 year and the show should be held in Indy. These combined shows are some of the largest in poultry history and we should be taking advantage of promoting our breed to the world. Most all the other breeds will be hosting their nationals at this show and what better way to educate and get new breeders involved than to have our show there. I know that people will say the show is in the Midwest too often, but this is an opportunity that dosen\'t knock too often. 1 year out of rotation will not throw a wrench into the system. 2012 would bring the schedule back into the rotation for Pauls district. Don\'t want to ruffel any feathers,just feel this is an opportunity we shouldn\'t let slip away like we did when it was there last time.
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the rotation should be broken for 1 year
Jerry and I talked about this possibility at the show in Ohio. All it takes is for the district directors to agree to do it. Paul and Jean would let it pass, so Jerry could place it at Indy. Then as part of the deal Harold and Barbara would also agree to let it pass so that it falls back to Paul in 2012. If they all want to do it the only monkey wrench would be if a new director didn\'t honor the agreement.
The directors can discuss the proposal via group email. The five of them have the power.
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If all agree, would we be trying to get the lavenders and splashes accepted at that point?
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I dont think that enough splash birds have been shown, but the Lavenders may be far enough along to try for qualification. John had done a lot of work on them, he would know more on the numbers and exhibitors that have helped him. If they meet all the qualifications, I think they should go for it.
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I believe this weekend at NEPC was the 2010 Bantam National. I looked around but did not see any bantam ameraucana. That does not mean there weren\'t any there, I just did not see them. I did accept and take a bantam araucana for another breeder. I\'m not a bantam person at all but this pullet sure was cute and very chatty for the drive there and back.
There were reportedly 3500 birds exhibited at NEPC this year. It was a nice, big show and very well run. Should anyone be interested, I\'ll post the large fowl ameraucana results tomorrow when I have access to a T1 line. I\'ll be reporting on the ACA site tomorrow as well.
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I believe this weekend at NEPC was the 2010 Bantam National. NO, THIS WAS THE 2009 NATIONAL. YES, I KNOW IT IS EARLY 2010, BUT IT WAS DEEMED THE 2009 MEET. CHECK THE AD INSIDE THE 2009 YEARBOOK, FIRST PAGE WHEN YOU TURN THE OUTSIDE COVER.
There were reportedly 3500 birds exhibited at NEPC this year. It was a nice, big show and very well run. Should anyone be interested, I\'ll post the large fowl ameraucana results tomorrow when I have access to a T1 line. YES, THAT WOULD BE GREAT. LET US KNOW NUMBERS AND THE JUDGES NAME IF POSSIBLE. THANKS!
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Hmm, my bad, I didn\'t see that! I will post the LF results on a new thread.
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Sorry I\'ve been so slow to respond. Just saw the forum today-first time in several days. I thought we learned at the joint APA/ABA in Columbus in 2002, that the joint nationals are too large especially when there is over 10,000 head, and over 30 national breed meets. Our great breed, the \"Ameraucana\" was put off being judged, when it was promised. However if the joint meet is what we want to do it\'s OK with me.
I\'ve tried to get some show clubs in the South-Central District to respond for our Ameraucana national for 2011, but none have-so no commitments have been made.
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I agree with Paul the joint nationals are too large. I think we should stick with the rotation.
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Whatever is decided is fine with me. I would prefer we don\'t schedule a national that would conflict with Indy;s dates however.
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I agree with Mike,there will be breeders that want to attend this show if it is a national or not. I for one will probably attend this show regardless.
How can a show be too big? We would be showing our breed to the world and what better way than to a large group of poultry exhibitors. Granted we would have to take our turn with judging and it may not be in some peoples time frame, we just need to take our turn like everyone else. From what we understand, the judging takes place in the order they hear we want our show there. So the sooner we can make a decision, and the sooner we notify them, the sooner we will be judged at this show. This is what we were told at the last show they held.We have a unique breed of birds that can compete with everyone else and should not be afraid to do so.
We had a great time at the last show held in Pauls district and want to go down in that area again, just feel that the rotation should be broken for 1 year.
Like Mike and others, we will go to what ever show the group decides on, We just need to give Indy a chance at hosting our national.
Jake
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John and I are planning to show at Indianapolis, even if it is not the Ameraucana National. We would be willing to rent a table (our donation) to advertise the ABC because we feel that not showing off the club at such a big show gives a poor impression. If anyone from ABC is around and would like to hang out at the table and greet visitors with us, that would be great!
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I agree with you Ann, it does give off a bad impression if we dont participate. You can count on us to help out if this is not our national.
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I live within an hour of Indianapolis so I definitely will be at this show. The last time this big show was in Indianapolis, there were a lot of Ameraucana\'s in the show. More than some of the other breeds that did have their Nationals there. I was disappointed with how the Ameraucana\'s were judged with birds being placed at the top that didn\'t meet the minimum standard. (yellow/willow legs etc.). If we have our National there, then we can have an input on who the judge is and perhaps get a more representative example of the breed up on champion row. I do think more judges are becoming familiar with the breed but there some ,who undoubtedly will be working this show, that would do an outstanding job if we can get them.
Curtis
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I see both sides of this, however, I am planning on going with a trailer full of birds, ABC National or not. I\'ll have 3 other breed clubs nationals to divide time between. That is one of the problems I see with such a big show. However, I think the benefits out weigh the negatives.
Lori
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Since the 2006 national we have changed the way we place national meets. Then all the board members had a vote and now the just district directors will decide, but it would take all of them in agreement as I see it.
If you are a club member here is your chance to express your feelings on whether you would like our 2011 national at the APA/ABA Indy show or placed in the SC district (the clockwise rotation outlined in the current by-laws).
This time I plan to sit back and let the directors do thier thing.
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If I remember correctly, we discussed special provisions of moving an ABC national meet from a district to be placed at a special joint APA/ABA national, then the ABC national would return the following year, back to the district from which it was removed. Then the rotation of the 5 districts would resume.
Personally I think our national ABC meet will be lost in the crowd of national breed meets at the joint APA/ABA national, but if that is where most ABC members want to show, I\'m willing to let it be there, as long as the SC District gets the national back in 2012. Who knows-I may not even be
re-elected to serve another term. I do know that united we stand, but divided we fall.
I also know an Ameraucana national meet will have a much larger show in Indy than it could have anywhere in the SC District, as we only have a few members who show. I have worked on this problem for over a decade. It seems as most who start out showing quit in a few years, after experiencing how much work and expense the poultry hobby creates.
I would appreciate hearing from all the district directors and as many ABC members as possible on this. Lets keep all correspondence here on the forum so it will be open for everyone interested to see.
Thanks,
Paul Smith
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That is very open minded Paul. Rest assured that Mary and I will make plans to attend no matter where you place the ABC National in 2011. You have probably logged far more miles than any of the rest of us to attend nationals in the past ten or so years. We will be behind your decision 100 percent.
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I agree it will be a very large show, however, I think the goal of getting the lavender and splash accepted to the standard outweigh the negative aspects of the large show. This is probably one of the few shows that it would be possible for a long while.
Now, if we decide that it is not the right time to try to get these birds accepted, then I would say skip it.
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My experience with the joint nationals is that we are just a number in a crowd. If the meet were to be placed there, would we be given an award package? Would we be given raffle table space or would we have to rent our space? Would we get several tables to do our egg contest and our club business or would we only be given one table?
We placed our call duck national at the last joint national- the call duck entries at any national will be at least 700 birds so a big draw. We had to rent our own raffle table space and cages for those raffle birds at that show and we were given only one table for club business and had to fuss to get that second table for the raffle. I also dont recall an award package. We were treated like a number in the crowd, and we had the largest national. Yes, Bill and Dave were friendly and wonderful men that they are- top notch guys, but we were not given any special treatment like we would have gotten at a smaller show.
I would rather see our national meet go to a show that it will make a difference for that particular show. A show that will offer a decent award package to get our national meet and a show that we will be treated special- not just another number in the crowd.
If we feel that we need to be represented at this joint national, why not place a district or state meet there?
As to the Lavendar acceptance, we can go with a meet other than this one. I know for an acceptance of a variety, it is suppose to be a semi annual or annual meet of the APA or ABA, but for special situations, they have bent that rule. The chocolate calls were accepted at the Lucasville, OH, meet. It was not a semi-annual or an annual meet or either the APA or ABA. They just approved this other meet for this one situation. Will they do that for us as well? I dont know, but we certainly could ask if that situation arose.
Dont get me wrong, the joint national will be a fabulous show with tons of birds to enjoy... but is it the right meet for us? I dont know. I guess I would love to hear what they will offer us in an award package before I made my mind up either way. I have seen the call duck offer, and will not vote in favor of placing the call duck national at that meet.
Has Bill or Dave put in an official bid to the ABC and what was included on that bid? I think that info would help us all to make informed comments - right now it is all just a lot of questions...
Just thoughts to consider...
Patty~
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Thanks Patty for sharing your experience with the huge shows!
Thanks Jean, I must also agree this could be a great show to get the varieties that the ABC has been working on recognized.
What about the black gold?
Thanks Mike for your support. Even though we missed the last two nationals we have been many thousands of miles to go to the nationals. Now that the house is livable, but not totally finished we are going to start going again. We didn\'tgo last year but three of our best black pullets did. Thanks to Dennis, they were 1st, 3rd and 4th. I understand he managed to get a good black cockerel for them. Everyone will have some tough competition at the 2010 national! Yes, my goals are being accomplished! Thanks Dennis. I\'m looking forward to meeting you at the 2010 national.
Jerry, could we get you to get a bid from Bill Wulff for the ABC national at Indy?
I\'ll contact Bernita Mill for one at Sedalia.
I\'m hoping others will let us know your thoughts! Thanks to everyone who has!!
Paul Smith
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I will get on it right away
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This is what I got today
Below is the letter I sent to the officers
Michael@bantamhill.com
John@Ameraucana.org
specifically in July…thanks…Dave
The Crossroads of America Poultry Club is once again having a show.
The dates are October 28-29-30, 2011
Indiana State Fairgrounds in Indianapolis, Indiana
We are applying for the ABA and APA National Meets to once again have a Joint National Meet.
We want your club to be part of this huge event and hope to top all records we obtained in 2006. Please let me know as soon as possible if you would like to place your 2011 National Meet at our show. Once again we will be giving the Breed Club a say by ranking your choice from the list of our judges. The sooner your club returns written confirmation via letter or email I will add your name to the list. To ensure your top choices it is best to respond ASAP.
The minimum awards should be the same as in 2006. Each Breed Club National will receive $150.00 total in awards: two $25 plaques sponsored by our club if your club represents only Large Fowl or Bantams plus $100 in additional awards or four $25 plaques if your club represents both Large Fowl and Bantams plus $50 in additional awards and each breed club will have a table and two chairs.
I do not need information for the catalog until Spring of 2011 and will contact you all again later for that information. But feel free to start raising donations now for award money because you know the more awards you have up for grabs the more people who will enter in your breed.
If you have any further questions feel free to email me or call me at 1-765-825-0621.
Thanks…Dave Wulff
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We all understand that this decision is solely the decision of the directors, but you all asked for discussion, comments, and questions.. so here goes...
So to sum that up, we have been offered:
* $150.00 in plaques or cash/plaque combination to equal $150.00.
* One table with 2 chairs
* Judge choice depending on when the meet is placed.
1. Can anyone tells us what we usually get for an award package for the club national? This seems pretty low to me.
2. Can we run our egg contests, club business, and silent auction(if the directors choose to do one again) off one table?
3. Do we have the lavendars, black gold, or splash ready for standardization? Do we have the 5 breeders for 5 years in each variety, the filing fees, and the 50 birds of each color? Do we have verbal committments from breeders to bring a certain amount to that show for the qualification meet?
4. If I remember correctly, this show was a $3.00 entry fee in 2006. There was talk of raising the entry fee, has anyone heard if it did go up and if it did go up in price would that affect our numbers for those particular colors seeking a qualification meet?
5. Would it help the directors to poll the membership to see who all plans to attend this meet? I know plans change at the last minute, but it might give helpful insight at this point.
Just thoughts to ponder....
You all have a tough decision ahead. I know that many members will agree with me in that we truely do appreciate you all asking for membership comments and input before you go to final deliberation on this decision that you will need to make.
Thanks for including us all in your discussion process, not all clubs do that. It just shows how unique our club is and how our board is really thinking about how to best serve the ABC membership. You all are doing a wonderful job. I know you dont hear that often enough, but I for one do appreciate the time that you invest.
Patty
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I apologize for the delay in commenting. I\'ve been down with a stomach virus.
I have an email out to the southeastern district members asking for their thoughts regarding placement of the 2011 national meet. Personally, I feel it is Paul\'s call.
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This has not been put on the back burner. I have a bid from Bernita, waiting on one from the Kansas Classic in Hutchinson. I talked with Benny in 2004 about holding our national. He wasn\'t interested. When he saw our national show in Sedalia, MO. in 2005, he wanted one for 2006. Apparently their club has changed leadership, as I\'m now dealing with George. Planning on waiting only a few more days, then deciding they aren\'t interested.
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The article in the February Poultry Press that starts on page one and is continued on page three lists sixteen national meets already in place for the Crossroads show. The cutoff date for that issue was January 10th, so who knows how many more Nationals have been placed since the ABA placed their national meet there. The ABC would be Wa-a-a-y down the list for choice of judges and order of judging. Is anyone else beginning to think this would not be an optimal venue for us?
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Just a couple other thoughts to consider in your thought process~
Crossroads is running at the same time as the ARBA Rabbit Nationals (same location). So parking will be a challenge and hotels may also be hard to come by. Plan on some walking or possibly shuttle buses.
The poultry show will not be held in the same building they were before; they will use two buildings east of the old location.
I am sure that Bill & Dave will work all of this out, but I thought it might be good to point these issues out as well while the discussion is going on.
Patty
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Here is the bid from the Missouri State Poultry Association. The show would be at the fairgrounds in Sedalia, Missouri. This is not the same poultry club that held our 2005 national, as that club disbanded. I plan on presenting two proposals tomorrow for all the directors to vote on. They are already written-just giving a little time to consider each show first.
Paul,
Bid for ABC National Oct 15, 2011 or Oct, 2012 the 3rd Sat.
We the Missouri State Poultry Assoc. would like to host your national show.
Our building can hold up to 2,000 bird single caged. ABC can choose the judge you want out of the 4 judges that we will have.
We will rebate $1.00 per bird entered up to 100 birds.
We will have painted trophies for Champion and Reserve Champion bird.
2 or more tables for club meeting, silent auction.
ABC National will be in the first show starting at 8am. and will be on the front rows. Will advertise in Poultry Press.
We have several motels that we can use.
Prices this year was 55 dollars.
Please consider us for your national
Thank You
Bernita Miller
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Some of the issues of the Indy show were addressed in this issue of the Poultry Press.
I would think the main issue now is to find out who is judging and if we can still get our choice before it is too late.
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Proposal #1
Holding our 2011 National meet with the Missouri State Poultry Association at their fall show on Oct. 15, 2011 at the Sedalia, Missouri fairgrounds. So our breed the Ameraucana won\'t miss out on being part of the Crossroads of America huge joing APA/ABA national meet at Indianapolis, Indiana on Oct. 28-30, 2011, requesting it to be a district Ameraucana meet.
Proposal #2
Holding our 2011 National meet with the Crossroads of America joint APA/ABA national meet at Indianapolis, Indiania on Oct. 28-30, 2011, and holding our 2012 national meet with the Missouri State Poultry Association at their fall show the 3rd
Saturday, in Oct. 2012 at the Sedalia, Missouri Fairgrounds.
Sorry this has taken so long, I\'ve been waiting for a poultry club in Kansas to bid, so we could choose from three shows, but they haven\'t.
It doesn\'t matter to me, we will support our national meet at either show in 2011.
Paul Smith
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Your call Paul. We will support either choice. It does concern me somewhat that so many nationals are already ahead of us at Crossroads, but Sedalia is only a one day show.
There are advantages and disadvantages either way.
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I finally received a response from the Hutchinson, KS. show, below is what I received.
Paul Smith
At this time our club does not want to put in a bid for the National meet.
Having a hard time getting people to help with the regular show!
Sorry.
George
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I\'m surprised none of the directors have voted on the two proposals! I shall have Angela e-mail the other four
Jean R., Jerry D., Harold K. and Barbara C. to get them to view the forum to vote. If they are waiting on me, as I have written, either show is fine for 2011.
I vote for proposal #2, even though I think the ABC will be overlooked in the crowd of national breed meets, with only 13 days between the two shows, there probably won\'t be a good attendance if held at Sedalia, due to the ABC members who will have a long trip to either one or both shows. Sedalia, is just over 500 miles from me and Indianapolis is a little under 1,000. We plan on going to both shows, provided we have something to show.
Paul Smith
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Update:
The District Directors have voted and all agree to allow the 2011 ABC National meet pass to the NC district. Jerry is in the process of placing it at the Crossroads show in Indy.
2010 = SE
2011 = NC
2012 = SC
2013 = W
2014 = NE
2015 = back to the SE