Ameraucana Breeders Club
The Official Forum of the Ameraucana Breeders Club => Ameraucana Marketplace => Topic started by: Guest on December 23, 2007, 02:39:14 AM
-
Lavender Wheaten? What would that look like? We started breeding Wheatens & Blue Wheatens this year & might be interested in fostering development of Lavender Wheaten on the side. How would you go about that?
Thanks,
Laura
-
Maybe it wouldn\'t be as easy as I thought after giving it more thought. Mike Gilbert used a cross of wheaten and blue birds to develop blue wheatens and this would be a similar project.
I would think that a lavender wheaten would be a wheaten, but with lavender replacing the black areas. The neat part is that once they are developed they should breed true, not like blue wheatens that can produce three varieties when bred together.
First cross lavender with wheaten. The next year mate the F1 chicks together and hatch all you can. A percentage of these F2 chicks should be lavender wheaten.
You\'ve got to hatch as many as possible, of the F2 chicks, to increase your chances of getting lavender wheatens that second year.
Comments?
I know in developing the lavenders in the second year the chances of hatching a chick that was both lavender and had a pea comb was 1 out of 16. I hatched many chicks and ended up with one pullet and a couple cockerels that were lavender with pea combs.
-
WOW, How did this get separated from the original thread?
John, Doesn\'t lavender effect all the colors, lightening the entire bird as in the Milli Fluer to create Porcelain. I believe it would be a very light bird, definitely an eye catcher. Sounds like a great project.
glen
-
I split your post, since it creates a new topic.
Doesn\'t lavender effect all the colors, lightening the entire bird as in the Milli Fluer to create Porcelain
Yes, It looks like you\'re right and the lavender would dilute the other colors of multicolored varieties. I had only used it as a solid color, but after reading up on it I can see that it wouldn\'t do what I suggested. I had read that before, but I don\'t have all that stuff memorized.
-
:thinking:Glen,
You may want to go to the Australian site Backyard Poultry. They discussed the breeding of Lavender Wheatens. I believe they call them Champagne. One person said they look like a pink color. You could also breed a Lavender to a Buff and when you breed the F1 offsprings together you\'ll get what they call a lemon(quote from the site). Good luck in the New Year with your breeding. HS
-
This discussion reminds me of a Bible verse. I know I\'m using this out of context, but it goes, \"All things are lawful for me, but not all things are profitable. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be mastered by anything.\" (I Corinth. 6:12)
The application is this: whether we are perfecting the existing varieties or creating new - is our work in the best long term interest of the breed and of our time and resources invested? Count the cost. Will our work prove to be \"profitable?\" We might ask ourselves \"Do we have a hobby, or does the hobby have us?\" Merry Christmas!
-
Mike,
Very true words, but is it in the asking of what we do not that we understand what we have?
-
Link,
Here is a link to a picture of either a Lavender Wheaten or a Lavender BBR type rooster.
http://gallery.thepoultrykeeper.co.uk/v/thewinkingtiger/MVC-004S.JPG.html
May be a gold duckwing, wheatens may be a little lighter. The Lavender Wheaten hen should be a soft color? They say a pinkish color.
HS
-
Harry,
what a stunning bird. The hackles and saddles are lighter than I would have expected.
glen
-
He is such a pretty color!
-
Lavender Wheaten is a really nice color .
Miguel
-
In order to breed lavender into the wheaten line you would have to use some kind of bantam (self blue dutch) or if you are very lucky you may find a large fowl that was lavender. I did have a pullet segregate from my blueggers that was a large fowl and lavender but that was very unusual.
You are talking about a long term project if a person uses a bantam or even a large fowl. Lavender is a recessive gene and that makes the work of producing a bird that is purebred even more difficult. I hope anybody that wants to do this project has lots of patience and room to grow all the chicks. You also have leg color and muffs and beard to consider.
Tim
-
So the pictures are of my first cross F1. Now through extensive reading I found that they are supposed to feather out like a brown red ameraucana. I think the may be modified to be lighter by the possible influences of the lav gene, even though they only carry one copy. I think my best choices are the cockeral with gold and the black pullet. I have more in the incubator so these won\'t be the only ones. Anyone have a guess to the genetics of the white one. She is so pretty, I\'m keeping her anyway but I am interested in what caused her to be an anomoly. Any guesses?
-
I\'m getting a Wheaten pullet from Jean next week or the week after so I can do the same thing. Glad to see someone else is already working on this. Please keep us updated.
I haven\'t a clue about your white chick!
-
You\'ve got something there...but what?
A couple of my guesses are the lavender females are based on ER/ER instead of E/E. If they were E/E all the chicks should be black. If they are E/ER then at least some chicks should be black.
Another thing is the sex-linked silver/gold gene. If some pullets are silver, then I would think the wheaten is carrying silver. That could also explain why a cockerel is \"gold\" (S/s+) and the other \"red\" (s+/s+).
Does the end of the beak on the white pullet look yellow to you? If so check the pads of she feet for yellow or pinkish flesh color.
-
It does seem like the rooster would have to have a Silver gene to create a pullet like that, and the first male.
John, does a rooster having the silver gene in addition to a gold affect the Wheaten pattern in any way? Wouldn\'t his hackles be noticably lighter?
I have some beautiful Wheaten pullets (bantam Cochin X Marans) that got the silver gene from their Cochin Dad and they have light hackles with a little black ticking, not the color of a regular Wheaten. They look like Silver Wheatens. The one male offspring looks like a Golden duckwing.
This would make me think that the Wheaten coloration might be comprimised if she used this female.
-
Wouldn\'t his hackles be noticably lighter?
Yes, since silver is dominant. I didn\'t think any wheaten lines carried silver...so what are the other options?
-
very interesting. Here is the wheaten roo I used. I bought him from Jean.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr70/chicken2008_photos/Ameraucanas/newroo.jpg)
Here is one of the pullets I used from Harry, the other looks the same.
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr70/chicken2008_photos/IMG_3746.jpg)
together
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr70/chicken2008_photos/Ameraucanas/pen1.jpg)
I\'ll check the white chicks feet and beak when I get home. I love genetics...I am very fascinated by all this. I can\'t wait until the next batch hatches.
-
He looks like a normal Wheaten roo to me.
Could another rooster have been involved? Don\'t you have a black split male?
What did the 3 offspring look like as chicks, the down color?
-
There is no way the Wheaten rooster carried sex-linked silver.
Those birchen looking pullets must have been out of a different male. According to some reports, sperm can live as much as three weeks inside the female prior to fertilizing an egg. The first bird, a cockerel, looks split for silver and gold; the silver gene would have come from the lavender mother, so he could very well be out of the wheaten male.
-
There is no way the Wheaten rooster carried sex-linked silver.
Those birchen looking pullets must have been out of a different male. According to some reports, sperm can live as much as three weeks inside the female prior to fertilizing an egg. The first bird, a cockerel, looks split for silver and gold; the silver gene would have come from the lavender mother, so he could very well be out of the wheaten male.
That\'s true, wasn\'t thinking about 2 roosters! The male could have been out of the Wheaten, but definately not that first female. The second roo (or a third) could be the answer to the odd columbian type female too.
If the other male chick with more of a red coloration has no silver gene though (and is out of the Wheaten roo), wouldn\'t he be a better male to use?
Wait, would he have not gotten one silver gene from the mother too?
John, aren\'t my Lav cockerels both E/E?
One cockerel is completely Lavender, clean as a whistle, and the other one does have some very, VERY faint blonde in his hackles. Hard to even see unless you\'re looking for it.
-
Now you understand why I asked \"what are the other options\".
It didn\'t make since that the wheaten was the sire and I didn\'t want to say you were wrong in saying he was.
My LF Lavenders should be E/E, but since they were bred up from my blacks that sometimes have ER...they could also.
-
hmmm...I have 3 roosters, a lavender, wheaten and an EE. You guys are really bumming me out. I think I waited 2 weeks for them to \"cleanse\". So maybe my EE is the father. I guess thats what I get for my impatience. At least the batch in the incubator I know for sure they are a clean cross. Do you think any of them are a possible lav x wheaten cross? Any one need some EE\'s :p
Here\'s my EE roo....so you think he\'s the father of them all?
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr70/chicken2008_photos/Other%20Fowl/HandsomeJack.jpg)
Didn\'t mean to bum you out. Look on the bright side, if you have more eggs in the bator, then you\'re already back on the horse! Let us know how the hatch goes, I\'m very interested.
-
I have the same colors turn up out of brown red x black out of the lavender project.I was forced to make this cross due to not having any brown red hens 3 years ago.I have a light phase brown red hen & a birchen looking hen pop up from last years chicks.The last photo looks like the hens I used to get if I used a white roo over silver hen.The hens did not inherit the salmon breast .Silver over white produced good colors in both sexes.It also looks like the silver hens out of the Murry Mcmurry type easter eggers that carry the columbian gene.So it is hard to say which genes produced it.I would not use it for a breeder. Jerry
-
I better add I was reading the first page when I responded & then saw there was a page 2. Still not very good with this computer stuff.