Laced Blue Ameraucana

[Jean]

First generation - black ameraucana cockerel over blue orpington hen.

[Christie Rhae]

Wow that is encouraging to see that much lacing in F1!  I may not have that much success in F1 because I will be using E/E blacks.
 lol! maybe if I whine about it enough....

You poor thing having to deal with all that mud!  Spring time in Washington? lol

Andalusian egg update: non developing.     Dang it.  I will try again.

Last week I just so happened to come across some hatchery andalusians that a woman who lives in my area was getting rid of because she is moving back to the mainland.  They have just started laying.  I think one of them may have the correct lacing.  Gonna play around with what I have here until I can get the birds that I want.  
Sigh....so hard to get birds here.  Feeling sorry for myself a little this afternoon after candling my eggs.

[Jean]

It\'s been raining, snowing, hailing and blowing for two weeks straight and won\'t clear up until Friday.

[Chicklover]

Just set 12 Andalusion to use on the start of the project. I spoke to some friends and they feel that using the Andalusion to put lacing in is the right way if you are going to put another breed in to the mix. It is better not to put in an outside breed but if you can\'t get what you need then you sometime have to do it.

[Christie Rhae]

Yay!! Hope you get lots that hatch!

I am starting over. None of my Andalusian eggs developed. Trying to get chicks shipped this time.

[vanalpaca]

MyPetChicken has chicks (hatchery stock), so if my eggs don\'t do anything, I can try there. That judge guy doesn\'t seem to be on the computer, but maybe I can get something worked out before next spring when I will need them.

I will have a blue roo and a black roo this year though, so could I use a blue andalusian hen with them and try to hatch their eggs for starting the project?

Of course, I will have to find a started hen or two.....

[Chicklover]

Was talking with a breeder of Araucana\'s that used a andalusion to an araucana to improve the lacing in Araucana and she said that the best laced birds came from a splash to black. What do all you who have traveled this road before us think? Also should I breed an Andalusion Roo to the Ameraucana hen or the other way around? Which will give us the best type in the off springs?

[Christie Rhae]

I am curious about this too.  In my mind it should not make any difference if the pattern genes are there.  
Blue Andalusian breeders only breed blue to blue to perfect the lacing.
I was wondering about blue marans and the lacing that they are also supposed to have.  I corresponded with Bev Davis who has been breeding marans for many years and she said that she had heard it was a good idea to use a splash now and then to \"set the lacing\".  That does not make any sense to me but I am the one with no actual experience so what the heck do I know?  
Sometimes things on paper do not translate to actual tried and true experience.  Verrryy interesting...  

[Chicklover]

What she was telling me is that the splash is going to carry the genes also you just can\'t see what they are like you can in the blues. But if what w are looking for is blues then it makes since to use a splash because we will get all blues but I also know that it has to do with how many copies of the need genes that the splash is carrying that matters also. So I will put it out the all those that have travel this road already and get their advice.

[John]

she had heard it was a good idea to use a splash now and then to \"set the lacing\".

There are a lot of old wives\' tales and the chicken fancy has its share.  Some may turn out to be true and others really seem off the wall.  Bev sounds smart to not make the claim herself, but is just saying this is what she heard.  
Some of what we believe about genetics may be outdated in a few decades, but you\'re still father ahead to base your breeding projects on science and experience rather than sayings from the old timers that are just repeating what the old timers told them may moons ago.

[John]

splash is going to carry the genes also you just can\'t see what they are like you can in the blues.

only breed blue to blue to perfect the lacing.

If all your breeders were \"pure\" for all the required genes to produce good lacing, I don\'t think it would matter too much which mating you used since all offspring would have good lacing.  Until that day, I would say the only blue to blue mating idea is the only way to make sure your breeders either have the proper genes or are closer than the other birds.  Even after the genes are set in your flock you\'ll probably want to stick with blue to blue matings to keep improving...from good to better.

[Christie Rhae]

I just found some great info.  I am sure it is old news to most but I found it very informative..
albc-usa.org

I ordered it in print form so I don\'t have to burn up my printer..lol

There is tons of great info, I will quote a small part..

The law of ten states that in order to find one good representative, ten must be produced; to find one great individual, one hundred must be produced; to find one exceptional individual, one thousand must be produced. Retaining only the top ten percent each season will allow a breeder to make progress to- ward their desired goal.

Culling was organized such that the best representatives from each mating were retained so that no mating was favored over all others, even ones that produced more superior individuals. This approach allowed progress in pro- ductivity to be made while still retaining much needed diversity in the breeding population.

I think the article is about improving production mainly but I am sure can be applied to blue laced project.

Just me researching more...till I have the birds. lol

[Christie Rhae]

Also should I breed an Andalusion Roo to the Ameraucana hen or the other way around? Which will give us the best type in the off springs?

From what I have read I cannot see how it would make a difference if the andalusian bird is the cock or the hen.  I have not read about any of the pattern genes being sex linked.

I had thought I would start with blue andalusian cock and black Am hens just cuz it seems like the pattern genes can get spread out faster.  But actually, I guess it does not matter.  Probably the best decision would be to choose the best specimens of each breed, male or female and plan breeding pens from that.   I hope to have enough birds to have 3 lines of breeding the first year.

[Christie Rhae]

On the backyardchickens.com site there has been talk lately of being able to see lacing on the black birds.
BYC-ameraucana thread

There are pictures and I think I can actually see some faint lacing on the black feathers.  I think this might be helpful to us if we could actually tell if the black birds carry the pattern genes or not.

Update:
I am going to have very good quality blue andalusian eggs sent in a live chick box this time.  I hope they fare better than the eggs that came regular express mail.

Also.. I set some eggs from my hatchery quality andalusian pullet X splash ameraucana.  After a few weeks I will switch out with my black ameraucana.  These birds are not awesome and I am just experimenting until I get better birds.  But at least I have something to play with while I wait.  

My husband and I processed 3 cockerels last month and I am no longer afraid of having too many birds.  I know what to do with them...lol

[John]

I think I can actually see some faint lacing on the black feathers.

Here is a link to an old topic that touches on this subject. 
http://ameraucanabreedersclub.org/abcforum/index.php?a=topic&t=182